veta, just a heads up. one of the biggest reasons the rest of the world dislikes americans is because of our ignorance/arrogance. before you jump to where the grass is greener, please realize that most europeans are way gentler/kinder than how you come off.

To Monte: being that neither of my parents are Americans and I have indeed been around the world I can tell you there's a lot better places than the United States. To disagree is willful ignorance. You've either been sipping too much american kool-aid or you're mistaking affluence equivalent to that of the US as inachievable elsewhere. For the top 80% of household incomes it isn't bad here, being in the top 80% of incomes in europe is a lot better. You can reason this by virtue of the fact that the EU is richer than the United States. That being said, within a given region the inequality is nowhere near as ridiculous as it is in the United States, save for maybe former soviet union SRs.

So yes monte, I would get the fuck out of the United States as soon as I am given the opportunity. There's actually a growing percentage of children of immigrants first, second and third generations emigrating from the United States, I can provide statistics if you'd like. The truth is the super power the US was is on its way out. What's the point of living in the US, with its high rate of religious fanatics, criminals and corruption if I can have an equal or superior living standard elsewhere?

Are there worse off countries than the US? Sure, I'd say most of South America, for all its affluent white families has thousands of poor destitute families. Being that I have family in Argentina and Peru I've seen the disparity in income with my own eyes. Am I ignorant enough to think there isn't better places? No. I've seen them with my own eyes. I have family in Germany, Poland and Spain. And while I'd say Poland and Spain aren't the most fiscally responsible or prosperous nations I'd say they do rather well for what they've been dealt. Especially Spain, although my understanding is after Portugal receives foreign aid in the coming months (as Greece did) Spain will probably follow suite. That being said, I don't think anyone can even afford to give us aid so as a nation the US is shit out of luck.

Wrote that before I saw your reply. Yeah Monte I'm well aware. It has to do with their societal values. Arguably the difference in attitude to success sums up the difference in attitudes between American people and people of the rest of the western world.

In most western traditions there are stories or fables of men who were poor in money and power but rich in wisdom, intellect and fame. There are no such traditions in the United States. In fact when presented with a poor but wise individual most Americans would probably ask the cruel question: "if you're so smart why aren't you rich?"

Well my friend financial success is very rarely due entirely to admirable virtues like wisdom, work ethic, honesty, etc. The fact of the matter is that the people who prosper in this country have the worst ethics and are the quickest to turn on others. The fact is the rich and powerful got to where they are by stepping on everyone around them. And this is often reconciled with superiority. In the United States poor people blame themselves for being poor, when in reality it isn't their fault that they have been given no education, no food, and no opportunities. In other countries the people blame the government. This difference alone as gone a long way in preserving the status quo here and ultimately has led to the dire situation we are in today.

Summary: if the government doesn't help people in other countries people revolt or protest, in the US this only happens en masse during the upheaval of social issues like civil rights, women's suffrage, and a black guy becoming president.

Bill Gates, one of the richest men of this generation, has devoted endless funds to the eradication many illnesses worldwide. That's just one that comes to mind, but the generosity of the rich in this nation is second-to-none. As a matter of fact, the generosity of Americans in general is unparalleled. But I guess this doesn't factor into your equation of a nice place to live.

Go into your wikipedia and find out who has given the most aid to Haiti, or Japan, or any of a variety of other causes OUTSIDE OF OUR OWN FUCKING BORDERS.

But that's OK. You know better than I do, so there's no point in talking to you any longer about politics, lifestyles, ethics, etc. It's OK, I knew everything when I was 20 too. I've only become dumber as the years have progressed.

Just go away then Veta. Move to Germany.

BTW I've LIVED in spain for over a year and if you think they have it better off than we do you are crazy.

look im not questioning your personal experience that other places are better than america. i just dont appreciate fellow americans who dont either 1) have a sense of pride in their country, or 2) have a desire to make their country better. if you reach the conclusion that youd rather just run off to another country, id prefer that you do just that. i have pride in my country, and think that a lot of generations have sacrificed a shit-ton to get us to where we are now. i think its childish and immature to simply state, "yeah, but what have you done for me lately?"

i lived in taiwan 2 years. for the record, i like taiwanese culture more than american. one of the more interesting things that i heard a taiwanese person tell me was their respect for american pride. he said that if 911 happened in taiwan, most everyone who had the means would bolt from the country and flee for better places. he thought it was amazing that americans united after the attack, and became defiant.

i guess what im saying is that youre coming off as someone who is self-absorbed and self-serving. not that these things are bad in small doses, but in larger doses, i see them as immature. and im not too proud of "americans" like those.

i mean, i understand people who want to emigrate from america for noble purposes... refinding your family roots, being a missionary, exploring different world cultures. its just your arguments dont make you seem to fall into any of these groups. they seem very superficial, and very focused on ME. cultures arent good because people focus on themselves.

A few years ago it was common practice for americans abroad to say they were Canadian, do you still stand by your position even when presented with such an admonition? Thraxle instead of trying to find evidence FOR your world views why dont you try to create a world view that fits with reality? I am sure even in the times of vassalage and serfdom there were philanthropic nobles. That doesn't justify an archaic and unjust system.

im confused, is that admonition pointed at me or thrax?

Responding on my iPhone I'll give a concise reply later