Forum
Cowardice, gutlessness, and "oh i flag".
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jimmycolorado wrote
at 7:17 PM, Monday April 20, 2009 EDT
So, it's been my displeasure to witness despicable acts of cowardice on kdice so frequently that I can nearly guarantee you'll see it every game. The specific act? The "oh I flag to you" message.
Why do I think this is a problem? I'll attempt to explain it to you pea-brained peons. What happens when someone calls "oh I flag" when the game is say 3 or 4 rounds in? It causes the person who they flagged to, obviously the one with a slight lead on everyone else, to change their focus to other players on the board. Nothing wrong with that you say... WRONG! The person who called the "oh I flag" is now being ignored and free to sit there like a little sissy and watch as the leader takes out everyone else. He's the smart one, you say. Well, he's increased his position in the game, that's for sure, but as for smart? No, definitely not. He's taking advantage of a situation to the ultimate detriment of everyone else. So, you say, he's still getting a better position so he has to be smart? You could argue this point for a while, but what it really comes down to is enjoyment & cowardice, vs a few points. The flagger is not smart, he's just making the game less enjoyable for everyone else and being a coward. Smart or not, well it can't really be proved... but I'll always counter that argument with the fact that he may be smart, but he's a pathetic coward. It's part of the game, you say. It's not part of the game. It's not written in the rules, it's not a guideline, it's not kosher. The game is about taking territories and fighting until there is a victor and only a couple of challengers left. Those challengers were the ones who fought well, held their territory, and crushed their opposition to hold 2nd or 3rd. The ones who DO NOT deserve 2nd or 3rd are the ones who called "oh i flag" and then sat there, not earning their position. But flags are part of the game, you say... again. Yes, flags are, when you click that little button. Calling a "flag" in chat is NOT flagging, it's trucing. If you want to flag, click the flag and accept your position. Calling a "flag" (aka a truce) is meant to boost your position in the game, not accept defeat. In real life you need allies. True. This is not real life... this is a game that is meant to be fun. Calling these bullcrap flags is EXACTLY the same as saying "lets truce", but for some reason nobody sees that. I've seen quite a few people rage up about "trucing", but there's too many morons playing who don't consider "oh i flag" the same as a truce. It is exactly the same. Hopefully that has got you thinking. I have a particular hatred for this "oh I flag" crap because I play this game for a bit of friendly competition, and to pit my strategies against the opposition. I also watch sport on TV because it has good competition, not because I want to see one side, 5 minutes in after being scored against, say "oh we flag". What I want you all to do is not accept "oh i flag" anymore. I want to drive this culture out of KDice, so that we can have some good competitive games. I accept actual flags when I'm winning, for sure. I will never accept "flags". The dice, the territories, the strategy and the competition are what KDice is all about. The cowardly written "flags" are not. Think about it. jimmycolorado, aka the flag rager. |
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StormLord wrote
at 7:52 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT Point being victory is the goal. Either gaining 1st place in kdice or checkmate in chess. A dice not rolled or a piece not taken doesn't make for a boring game.
Rolling the dice isn't the skill (any muppet can click a mouse). The skill is from EVALUATING THE BOARD and making decisions accordingly. If that decision is to flag then so be it, you've used your skills (of evaluating the board) to the best effect. |
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Thraxle wrote
at 8:03 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT Your analogy sucks again since you are not attempting to take 1st in KDice with a flag or a vFlag. If the only enjoyment you get out of KDice is earning a few points, then we will never see eye to eye on this subject. Myself, and apparantly many players here, much more enjoy the opportunity to actually roll the dice and participate in the games.
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jimmycolorado wrote
at 9:59 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT @ MiCao
I have far less problem with anyone attempting to call a "truce" in the same situations they are now calling "flags". The reasons for this are that everyone understands what it REALLY is, and the currently winning player then realises that accepting a truce could be detrimental to himself. The current situation is almost forced trucing... someone "flags" and then if they aren't left alone they start crying "wtf i flagged", when that is simply not the case. If there was as little flag icon next to their name, or in the case of 99% of these "flags" they took 6th or 7th and left the game, then THAT is a flag. Anything verbal is a TRUCE. So, I hope that shows you my opinion. @ Fountain You didn't read my first post at all. Since you can't read: But flags are part of the game, you say... again. Yes, flags are, when you click that little button. Calling a "flag" in chat is NOT flagging, it's trucing. If you want to flag, click the flag and accept your position. Calling a "flag" (aka a truce) is meant to boost your position in the game, not accept defeat. More specifically though, and this relates to my answer above about trucing, if you were to call it what it really is... a truce... then THAT is a strategic move, with it's pros and cons, and consequences. As mentioned, the current situation with "flagging" and then expecting everyone to respect that fictional position is the problem. @ StormLord You defeated your own argument in your last post. Yes, there is skill evaluating the board and using strategy accordingly. You have completely missed the point though regarding "flags". You are talking about them like they are flags... they are NOT. They are TRUCES. If you take your entire statement, and replace the word "flag" with "truce", then that is a valid strategy, and as I mentioned above, with pros and cons, and most importantly consequences. |
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Avarice wrote
at 10:06 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT okay really tl;dr
Kill shit win, case closed. |
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jimmycolorado wrote
at 10:13 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT I would give my left nut for it to be as simple as that Av.
Actually... I have a solution to this ENTIRE problem... DISABLE CHAT!!!!! Never going to happen though... |
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Alala Alala wrote
at 11:11 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT The v-flag. It just sucks. The game has gone from one of battles to one of sitting and waiting.
The lower tables are actually the fun ones to play the game at. It's unpredictable and entertaining. Go up to the higher tables and you'll get v-flags in the second round. It really takes the fun out of the game. V-flags turn it into a giant circle jerk. There is no honor in rolling on your back. Verbal flags are lame. If I'm playing a game, I actually want to play it. Sitting around watching someone else win because I didn't have the balls to at least try for first... well, that's no fun at all. I think that's why people have such a negative reaction to them. They take the fun out of the game for most people. If you're one of the players who enjoy them, well you're just a pussy ;) |
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the brain wrote
at 11:30 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT Totally agree. I just got screwed in a game for being willing to fight. I took some risk by attempting to kill a 7-stack early on, and won, after which pretty much everyone 'flagged' and let the guy who lost the 7-stack kill me...
Anyway, the sad thing here is that these 'flags' are probably an optimal strategy when going for points, especially if you have some friends in the game (not pga, mind you). And once even only one persons flags there are two options: - everyone else flags and some people fight for 3rd or something (and in many cases some closed off player gets a position he doesn't deserve) - or people recognize it as a truce and counter it And in my recent experiences 95% of the time the first thing happens. And in many cases the earlier you flag the better position you get... In other words, once someone starts 'flagging' cowardice is actually REWARDED... And in my opinion that is just plain wrong. I like to think that I play a statistically sound strategy, but with all the 'flagging' going on that hardly matters anymore... |
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BAMMBOOZLED wrote
at 11:34 AM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT Once the very basic strategies are mastered the only skill of note in the game is DIPLOMACY. The chatbox is part of the game. Once, by utilising the chat box, I came 1st with only one territory (this was in a non pga situation). It was far more satisfying than gormlessly pushing dice around a board.
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Fountain wrote
at 12:04 PM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT @jimmy
since you decide to be ignorant Ill have to point something out. you cannot technically flag inside the first 9 rounds without going out in the bottom position. If it were possible to flag your current position in those rounds, then I would agree and say people should click the button. Since that option is not possible, the verbal flag rule was created by kdice players. Since you are aparently able to read but not comprehend what I was saying I suggest you re-read my first post. Or perhaps re-re-re-read it as many times as it takes to sink into your skull. verbal flagging when you only have 1 or 2 territories is indeed lame, but doing so really only hurts those players as they lose dom over time which will often not make up for the one position you might make up. But flagging once you know you are beaten is not stupid, and is not a truce. It IS accepting defeat, because it means you can no longer win. Does it mean that the 2 involved parties can now focus on other players? Yes. Is there still the option of the other players teaming up against the 2 parties? Yes. But generally it isnt in their best interests, to try to take on someone stronger and in a better position. Thats just idiocy. If that is how you prefer to play the game Jimmy then all the power to you. If you see someone flag to someone else by all means dive headfirst into whoever you want. But I almost guarentee you will lose, waste your points and your time. |
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MrDolomite wrote
at 1:16 PM, Tuesday April 21, 2009 EDT Agreed and well said.
I would rather fight and lose, rather stand idle doing nothing and place because I was someone's no-battle b!tch and was sure to holler "I flag to xyz" |


