"Corporations have no morals, no ethics, no code of conduct, no feelings, no empathy and zero accountability. They have one goal and one goal only; increase profit at all costs."

This is a very shortsighted viewpoint. One of the best ways to increase sales and profits is to become a visible contributor to the local community where corporations are located. Charitable events are sponsored by corporations. Donations for hospitals, healthcare facilities, scholarship funds, and a variety of other causes are massively funded by corporations.

For fuck sake, look no further than Bill Gates and his fight to iradicate like 100 illnesses throughout the world and you'd realize that corporations are not all evil and self-fulfilling.

I think you have a bad case of one bad apple spoils the whole bunch. If one company fucks up (i.e. BP or Enron), you hear about it in the news for months and years. You don't pay attention to the thousands of companies that do good every single day.

Pretty sure corporations wouldn't waste their time with shit like that if there weren't tax beaks and such in it for them. Bill Gates is a good guy that made a lot of money off a corporation. It isn't the Microsoft Foundation, it's the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation that you're referring to. To my knowledge Bill Gates isn't even running microsoft anymore anyway.

So I guess that's proof that regulation (through tax breaks) is good then?

Let me put it to you this way Rob, show me one example of a corporation doing some for the benefit of society (without receiving any sort of compensation or gain in return, from the government or otherwise) and I'll show you 10 example of a corporation employing underhanded and even illegal practices to improve its profits.

The good cases are harder to find because nobody reports good news, they only report bad news.

Just because there is a tax break involved doesn't mean that's the only WHY for doing something. Rich people get rich off their corporations they own. The rich of this country are some of the most charitable people on the planet. The Bill & Melinda Gates foundation would not exist without the successes of Microsoft. Bill was CEO of that company for many many years and he isn't evil. He isn't in it just to make more profit. He's charitable. He's giving. He's very empathetic. So many others are too.

Am I saying there aren't evil corporations out there? No. Do we need "some" regulation of business practices? Sure. But I'm sure the level of regulation you would like far exceeds the level I would like.

Sure Rob, I recognize there's rich people that do good things. There's actually a word for it, I think it's called being a philanthropist. Unfortunately not all corporations are run by philanthropists (most are owned by stockholders whose mandate is the profit of the company and have nothing to do with the particulars of a company, like Bill Gates and Warren Buffet might).

To put it into perspective Rob, GE made about 15 billion in profits this year. It paid a total of 0 taxes. I'm sure GE does a lot of wonderful things, like scholarships and such. But if you're trying to argue that they would do this WITHOUT government incentive then I think the cards are stacked against you. The same is true of McDonalds (I forgot the figure) but they also paid a particularly low tax rate in the US. And indeed McDonalds sponsors many scholarships and charity events. But if you're trying to argue they would do so without government incentive, I think you serious underestimate the fact that the ONLY common interest stockholders of a company have is its profit. Companies are owned by stockholders, not CEOs or board members. The board answers to the stockholders, who are only concerned with profit. The CEOs answer to the board, which is obviously concerned with appeasing their stockholders and of course whatever interests they themselves might have. Ultimately the priority of a company is profit by whatever means necessary.

People on the other hand, on an individual basis, do have morals and codes. But unfortunately these are not universal, and often times financial benefit trumps moral values.

Heard about the Nike sweatshops in Malaysia? What about that big fruit company that owns the fruit industry in guatemala, turns out their field overseers were just shooting anyone caught stealing. This is the shit I am referring to. If companies are left to their own devices this is what happens. Shit, even if they are regulated they still try to find ways around the rules.


So let me reiterate: Corporations have no morals, no ethics, no code of conduct, no feelings, no empathy and zero accountability. They have one goal and one goal only; increase profit at all costs. Regulation is a necessity, not a hindrance. Prove otherwise and I'd immediately too become a libertarian.

Also another reason why success as the leader of a private company does not translate well to success as in a government office. In the private sector you are concerned with self interest, in the public sector you are concerned with the welfare of the populace.

So you'd rather tax the corporations and have the companies do ZERO in community service. That's a really bad idea. But, as a democrat, I understand your want for the goverment to control every aspect of the business world, healthcare world, education world, retirement world, etc. I know you're a socialist at heart, so agreeing to disagree is just fine. You wouldn't change your point-of-view if for anything anyways.

You want to regulate the entire business world to eliminate the minority that expose its flaws. Should corporations be taxed? Yes, they should. But incentives to do good in the community should always be there. Caring corporations do a lot more good for the common man than the U.S. Government does. Unfortunately you just want government control to overtake this country, and that is a horrendous ideal. Punish those that break the law. Properly write the tax code to increase government revenue a little bit. Kill the military machine that has become our country. And get the lazy fucks in this nation off welfare. (notice I said only the lazy fucks....feel free to interpret that the wrong way and accuse me of not being empathetic, I'm ready for that) Fix social security and RAISE THE FUCKING RETIREMENT AGE. Life expectancies continue to increase while the retirement age lags way behind. People should be working well into their 60's now. Sorry if that pisses off anyone. The U.S. tax payer shouldn't be responsible for paying your bills for the final 20-25 years of your life. Fuck off if you think otherwise.

And to answer your question, yes, companies would still do good without tax incentives because being visible in your community helps your company in many ways (yes, mainly financial ways, but money is what drives the fucking world, you'll realize this once you have a mortgage and other bills).

fuck it

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