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44 days in...
Thraxle wrote
at 11:18 AM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
...and there is no sign that Mr. Obama is any different from the past democrats that sat in the oval office. The only exception is that he has 100% compliance within his party and a majority in congress that will pass anything Mr. Obama supports.

How hypocritical is it that Mr. Obama continues to remind the general public of the deficit he inherited, but then spends so recklessly that the possibility of having a balanced budget anytime within his term is utterly impossible.

How hypocritical is it that the libs called the recent spending bill that was passed a "stimulus package". How does $20 billion dollars towards food stamps stimulate the economy? What jobs will be created by increasing food stamp allowances? This is only one example of many within that spending bill, but I'll try to avoid making this post unneccisarily long.

One of you left wingers need to help me understand what our President is attempting to do. The view from the cheap seats here in right field makes the picture look exactly like I thought it would look before the election took place; the liberal democrats want a socialist republic in place of our cherished capitalistic society. Let's continue to drain the rich to pay for the poor. Let's continue to increase taxes on large corporations that have been laying off employees at an enormous pace. Let's increase benefits to the unemployed instead of finding ways to provide jobs for them.

I'm ranting a bit, but one thing is clear. Barack Obama scares the living shit out of me. JP, UGB, anybody, please help me feel better about the job he's doing.

And someone explain to me how the fuck he has a 67% approval rating. They must have done the polling at a foreclosure seminar or a foodbank.

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Cal Ripken wrote
at 1:37 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
lol at Rifty's post (which makes a good point).

Yo Thrax, I think you've gotten better answers than I could come up with eloquently. I don't claim to be an economic expert so I wont comment heavily on your concerns, because I really don't know much about it's intended benefits. I know a lot of the money is geared towards education and energy (and obvious job creation in both). I also know that the monetary risk isn't as large as everyone seems to making it out to be.

Deregulation (which was bipartisan idiotic move, one that Sen. McCain spearheaded) screwed most of this shit up and I much more confident in having Obama and his staff in charge of trying to fix it.

Seriously though, all of this throwing around the word "socialism" is ridiculous, and reminds me of how fox news started use the word "liberal" as an insult. Socialism is neither a bad thing, nor anywhere NEAR what this country is, or ever will become.

Republicans (case and point this week's convention) love to say they are distanced from the Bush administration and thusly both absolved of responsibility for the mess we are in and the ones best suited for fixing it. That's complete BS. It's the fraudulent spending and loosening restrictions/responsibilities of the business world that has screwed everyone and IMO everyone who is responsible for Bush being in office for 8 years is responsible, because a lot of us saw this coming. I'll trust that Obama knows what he's doing before I'll believe that ANYONE else would do a better job.


Sorry if my response sounds heated/insulting in anyway, not my intention.
Cal Ripken wrote
at 1:38 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
I'd say "read DailyKos" but it'd probably piss you off too much ;-)

Don't watch cable news. They should all be jailed.
Thraxle wrote
at 1:51 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
Actually JP, your response was much less heated than I expected.
Cal Ripken wrote
at 2:07 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
Fascist.
Thraxle wrote
at 2:14 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
hehe
skrumgaer wrote
at 3:07 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
Corporations began as entities created and defined by government. What government created, government can change. In the United States, corporations are state creations. But state corporation law is overlain by federal regulation. So we have 51 overseers of the corporate environment. Whether, and to what extent, corporate law should be changed will depend, I suppose, on the reason that corporations were created in the first place. The key attribute of corporateness, limited liability, was instituted to reduce the downside risk to contribution of capital.
Thraxle wrote
at 3:12 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
Damn it skrum, don't tease me. Teach me more!!!

Is the U.S. federal government doing the right thing by throwing money at the problem?

Is the "redistribution" of wealth beneficial to U.S. society as a whole? (that's not a shot at Obama, it's an honest question)

skrumgaer wrote
at 5:14 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
Thraxle,

I am not a left winger so I am probably not in the best position to explain what Obama is up to.
existential wrote
at 6:57 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
to thraxle, i can't quell your fears of obama. i can tell you to keep working to make people actually think and pay attention to what's happening to the USA.

to stormlord, i found the article interesting but typical of the drivel the mainstream media throws to the masses.

without getting too intricate or lengthy, let me put out my thoughts on the issue.

1- capitalism (aka the invisible hand) works.
2- we haven't seen true unadulterated capitalism in our country for many years (pre-FDR?)
3- the government has become a false invisible hand that fights true capitalism.
4- two invisible hands =/= capitalism.
4- you cannot say that capitalism has failed if capitalism has not been in practice.
4- (pay attention to this stormlord) economic data can be manipulated to say whatever you want it to say.
*example 1* citizen 1 receives $100 from the government. citizen 1 pays citizen 2 $100 (plus tax) for groceries. citizen 2 pays citizens 3, 4, and 5 $100 (minus income tax) as employees. according to the cumulative income reports, those 5 citizens have received $500 total.
*example 2* bank 1 loans 1,000,000 to bank 2. bank 2 loans 100,000 to bank 3. bank 3 loans 10,000 to bank 4. according to the cumulative accounts receivable, there is suddenly 1,111,000 on the books.
5- gradual change to an inferior and smothering system is no better than immediate change to an inferior and smothering system.
6- no individual has ever gotten out of debt by buying everything they ever wanted. why would it be any different for the USA as a country?
existential wrote
at 7:00 PM, Wednesday March 4, 2009 EST
as an afterthought-

when kdice makes changes, those who are intelligent adapt and continue fighting to win.

this is no different.
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