I like plain and simple rules. And I agree that to have the old flagging system work better than it did before, the RC needs to be added as well.

chosing exactly when you leave a game and knowing beforehand how many points that will give you is so much easier.

some aspects of the current flagging rules are fun to play with because it gives plenty of extra strategic dimension but if I had to chose only one flag system for eternity I would go with your idea awes.

The old version would also give much better opportunities to finetune the RC detector because it might also be possible to take into account wether or not certain players seem to protect another one when in fact the friend was small all game

I agree. The 16 dice test server should be reopened again.

Wait, what? Oh. I agree nevertheless.

I think you're forgetting some of the bad parts of the old flagging.

Here's a common scenario: 4 players left, 2 are small, 2 are big. Who does #1 fight? #2 of course... why waste dice on the small guys. In this case #2 should go after the small guys to ensure 2nd - when really he should be fighting 1st. The two small guys, #3 and #4, are going to wait it out in hopes of somehow getting 2nd. Why? because they know that 2nd can flag out to maximize points. This is very bad... quite a few games ended like this... lower players holding on to place higher than stronger players.

With the current flagging #3 and #4 know that #2 can't flag out. #2 can focus on fighting #1 or flagging to #1 - this is a much better game for higher placed players more choices and better ability to use their rightly obtained power.

Of course there's the abuse that people flag early but this isn't nearly as bad. So what if someone flags early for second... you don't have to respect it - attack the guy. This really isn't that bad when compared to the endgame weirdness of the old flagging.

Ryan the problem you are stating is a real one, but it was the only real problem. With the current system no one fights for 1st anymore then they did in the previous system, since they can flag for 2nd and if 1st respects it helps to secure 2nd.

This current flagging has neutered kdice, no one fights for anything any more. This is especially true at the higher tables as politics has been increased which creates an even barrier to entry to newer players as there is little reward for fighting unless you know the people at the table and know the politics.

I think combined with the RC lists the old flagging would be far superior to the current system and would help even the playing field in the upper tables for newer players.

There will always be problems, I just think the old system had less problems then this system. The flag and surrender both allowed people to save dom and reduce bickering.

If there was a way to have bot systems that would be great but I don't know how feasible that is and given the choice I would prefer the older system. Not that I have a choice because I will keep playing kdice either way, just saying as a member and a relatively frequent player what I feel made my experience the most enjoyable.

Yes, the quality of the game has went down since the new flagging just leads to more begging and 1-2-3 truces. I even saw Ryan beg for second with a mediocre clutch on it in one game, and he's the freaking game creator.

I think its important to seperate a game mechanic problem and a game quality problem.

The old flagging had a game mechanic problem where it would create odd gameplay like a small player coming second simply because second flagged out to save dom. This type of problem MUST be fixed.

The current problem is less severe and a game quality problem. This type of problem doesn't cause weird game motivations. Instead its a problem that makes the game less satisfying. These are easier to solve when the game mechanics work. The new flagging system mechanics work well and promote how the game should work well.

So instead of going back to the old way, where game quality might have been higher is certain circumstances, the we should look at what can be done to improve the game quality. In this case, what can be done to have more action late in the game. Going back to the old flagging isn't an option since it broke the how the game should work.

If first was the only position that rewarded points the game would be world's better.

Everyone going for first is fun. A 1/2 truce round one with everyone else playing for third and bitching about how they deserve it because there start was better is retarded.

How do you have a 1/2 truce round 1? I haven't seen any games like this.


Every once and a while someone mentions rewarding only first. It's something thats been considered and won't happen for two reasons.

1) You get into a cycle of ganging up on the big guy until your the big guy and everyone goes for you... until round 150 when everyone gets board and closes their browser.

2) A game with 6 losers isn't as fun.

That's why gpokr is so boring... I hate it when I have the second best hand on the table and I still lose. I should get like 1/3 of the pot for having 2nd best right?

Having four losers and two guys sitting around waiting for flags isn't all that exciting either, Ry.